School Shootings – the Easy but Unconstitutional Fix
The shootings this morning in Texas were a gut-wrenching tragedy. We see this a lot now, disturbed people who are already suicidal and want to make a “statement” of some kind. They see this in the media, and they want the “glory” of leaving this world while making a name for themselves, social media style.
Fixing this is easy. It is just not Constitutional. And I may lose some readers over this thought.
No, it is not gun control. Someone can do close to the same damage with a knife or a car, it would just change the fashion, not the attitude.
I’m a little out of my head this morning, so let’s embrace some of that crazy. If my writing friend Larry can advocate bumping off Putin, let me take it a step further.
This is strictly fantasy, I would not and would never do this or advocate this, certainly not by police, nor do I recommend it to BLM or the Klan or the Hells Angels or other underground gangs who might have the capability and the sympathy for dead children.
But what if one of these shooters became even more famous because they “escaped” and were kidnapped by a nice vigilante group, and shown the error of their ways? Perhaps a good combination of lessons from the Wiki page on “methods” or something from the movie Law Abiding Citizen.
For a long time.
Make a video.
Publish the video.
I can guarantee you that after a couple of times, school shootings would stop. These shooters may be unstable, they may be suicidal, but once they realize that their end will be more like this than it will be like Bonnie and Clyde, they will find something else to do.
Extraordinary measures to protect something extraordinarily valuable – our children. Clearly, our government has no clue how to handle this, our education system is in shambles, students don’t know right from wrong, being popular is more important than life itself. The Trump solution to arm teachers would work, but the liberals who control the schools won’t do it.
Wow! Glad I got that off my chest. I don’t believe in vigilantism, I don’t believe in cruel and unusual punishment.
My heart goes out to the parents of the kids killed today, I hope they get some peace.
The shooter should be shown more pain than they can endure
That seems to be what the author was intending to say when he mentioned some Wiki page on “methods”, though they way he alluded to it rather than clearly stating the actual name of the page, so others could actually see what he was talking about was pretty poor on his, and his editors part…
One commenter seems to think the author was referring to “summary and public execution”, though I have no idea where he got that idea from since the article didn’t mention that, and no reference regarding what particular article on Wiki the author was alluding to was mentioned either…
In any case, you’re right, but of course criminal loving, bleeding heart Liberals would never allow that to ever happen…
They need the violence and the tragedies to continue, and even accelerate, in order to keep promoting their “gun control” agenda, whereby they constantly seek to punish and disarm innocent law-abiding Americans who had nothing whatsoever to do with the crime, while doing everything in their power to minimize consequences for criminals, and putting them back on the street to continue their violence as fast as possible…
Most replies to this situation miss several points. First, It’s rather silly to suggest lengthy prison sentences when the shooter was killed by police or commits suicide. Second, liberal idiots like to suggest abolishing the second amendment as if guns per se were at fault not the human with a finger on the trigger. The liberal media don’t cover gun related violence over seas as that would negate their argument and destroy their political base. Third, Our criminal justice system is broken and is just as responsible for mayhem as the criminals. Just look at the record of VP Harris when she was Attorney General in California. Fourth, Our legal system, both lawyers and judges, is responsible for not awarding appropriate sentences or bargaining for light sentences when harsher punishment is appropriate. The harshest gun laws are in the States with the highest gun violence, e.g. Illinois, California, New York, etc. Liberal political morons refuse to get their heads out of their arses when it comes to the issues and causes surrounding gun violence. Finally, criminal justice reform must also include effective discovery and treatment for mentally disturbed individuals, particularly our youth. Term limits for all political office holders would be a great way to start the reform process.
MASS. Shootings are ONLY in this Country, WHY ??
Once Convicted of a CRIME, Every Convicted Criminal MUST be RUN Thru a Weeks Training of:
“SCARED STRIAGHT” at the Closest PRISON !!. The shooter should be shown more pain than they
can endure !!. This is the ONLY WAY to STOP these Mentally SICK Persons…
The mass shooting of innocent naive young students and a couple teachers is nothing but PURE EVIL in the form of a human! When innocents are murdered repeatedly, that is the act of the horned one who has summoned a weak and demented human to destroy our most precious gifts — our young children!
The kid who was killing other kids was only 18 years old! What broke inside his head/heart to destroy our beautiful young children? What anger/terror set him off? Find that out and you can possibly STOP another 18 year old from committing mass murder!
Personally, since JB in the White House is the worst most incompetent leader in our U.S. history, getting a solution from him will never happen. In fact, we will see more and more EVIL because this Country FOOLISHLY defunded its Police, so who is left to protect the populace?? No one! It’s the “Devil’s Playground” now! So YES, let those WOKEISTS AND TINY TERRORIST organizations grab the next Evil Shooter and teach him WHY he will NEVER shoot anyone again!!
FYI: So how do you like the disaster of a country the CLUELESS AND IDIOT DEMOCRATS CREATED BY INSTALLING THAT POS IN D.C.? I GUARANTEE THAT IF THE RIGHTEOUS AND LEGAL WINNER OF THE 2020 ELECTION, DJT, WERE IN OFFICE, NONE OF THIS EVIL CRAP WOULD BE HAPPENING!
This HORRENDOUS SHOOTING RESPONSIBILITY IS ON EVERY DEMOCRAT THAT HAD A PART IN THE MANIPULATION OF OUR 2020 ELECTION!
DEMOCRATS: May those innocent “CHILDREN’S SOULS” dance in your nightmares every night for what you have done! You deserve every torturing dream of the innocence you had a part in killing!
not a practical or legal solution….therefore…NOT a solution.
however, if congress were to authorize the summary and public execution of these shooters that are captured in the act, it would indeed serve notice to these maniacs that their insanity is best kept to themselves.
this would of course be argued against by the liberals but who really cares about that. the liberals will protest anything that protects the people of this nation from their dystopic perspective.
No, its not a legal solution, but it is a practical one and would be the fastest to solve the problem, i.e. immediately. Of course, I am not advocating for any group like the Hells Angels or the Mafia or any other extremist but patriotic group to to take matters into their own hands to protect children.
Not sure that I want public executions to be a normal thing, but might make an exception for this. Might not be to effective though, since many of these are already suicidal.
Joe we will take whatever help that we can get.
Or some Lawyer would probably plead “Insanity” and get the kid off. But being that he was 18, he would be tried as an adult, albeit a CRAZY adult!
Actually he was sacrificed by the evil now in control of our Nation! His life gone only to be replaced by some other cuckoo to do more dirt!
When you are dealing with the Evil One, the writer of this article is right. Conventional methods can’t apply. Why? Because Evil doesn’t follow the rules — NO, Evil plays dirty! To beat Evil, you have to beat it at its own game — play dirty back! That’s why the suggestion of letting BLM or Antifa grab the next shooter (because there WILL BE another one) and let them leash out the punishment he deserves! It’s radical, but when there is NO LEADERSHIP coming from our highest office, Americans are going to have to take things into their own hands! Sounds like a preCivil War situation to me.
What Wiki page on “methods”…? Methods for what, exactly…? If anyone actually knows what this guy is alluding to, please fill the rest of us in…. in the meantime, it’s just an example of some very poor writing right there…
Watch Law Abiding Citizen, you will get it.
Democrats want shootings hoping to advance their socialist agenda. They sure as hell don’t care about the lives of unborn babies And beatoff O’roark doesn’t help their cause running his damned stupid mouth while governor abbot was trying to give an update
We seem to worry far too much about cruel and unusual punishment. This is where our legal system and our namby-pamby lawmakers run off the rails. The intent of the rule against cruel and unusual is meant to keep a lid on such things as torture and dismemberment of incarcerated individuals, be it those in for misdemeanors or felonies. I submit that if punishment is not cruel or unusual it serves no purpose. Cruel can mean anything from the unconventional methods used by Arizona Sheriff Joe Arpaio to the really draconian stuff once practiced in Great Britain up to as late as the 19th Century. Yes, these things were barbaric and should not happen in a civilized society. But without more certain and harsh punishments for those who perpetrate such horrors as this senseless act, we will continue to see these things happen. I suggest we get serious about preventing such things. 1) FORTIFY school grounds to keep such whackos from getting in. 2) Arm your teachers with guns if they wish to have them. 3) NEVER reveal the name of any such offender. They want notoriety? Give them oblivion. 4) Lock them up at the VERY least and throw away the key, so to speak. No parole, no time off for ANY reason. If they are terminally ill, let them die in prison. No compassionate leave or anything of the sort. They show no compassion when they act as animals and deserve no compassion from us in punishing them. They act like rabid dogs and as such, it may be the best idea to “put them down” for the public good. Not to mention, as a warning to others.
Let’s take a moment to recognize our brave school children who laid down their lives for our right to bear arms!
Hey!! At least they weren’t being taught Critical Race Theory!
Thoughts and prayers!
And I’ll keep and bear my arms. So fuck you very much
Makes Yogi very happy.
Remember the Oscar Myer Hot Dog Song?
More guns, kids need more guns
what kind of guns need more kids?
Big guns, small guns,
Guns that shoot small rocks
tough kids, sissy kids
even kids with monkey pox
love more guns, we need more guns
the guns kids love to shoot
Hell yes!!!
Hire veterans for guard duty at all the schools. Get the school where it can be locked down and then no one can just walk in. Give the guards as well as the police a Cart Blanche right to kill perps with no fear of persecution and your kids will be safe. All your congressmen have armed guards and locked gates. I would just as soon trade the lives of all those on capital hill who are ProAbortion for the lives of those children. jwstx
“BaCk tHe BLuE”
Once again, police were too afraid to protect the children.
I don’t know why you’re even writing about this. Here’s how it’ll go…
Rational people: “we are the ONLY Country that this happens in, something needs to change!”
Gunnuts: “ how dare you use this as a political stunt, it’s too soon”
Rational people:” oh, sorry…”
Next week, it’ll be forgotten about and we will be talking about Jewish space lasers, how Putin won the war, CRT, and GRT. Problem forgotten about!
I tire of the haranguing on both sides. The right offers prayer and demands mental health; the left offers law and demands gun controls and limitations. Enough. Like covid, it’s just a disease we need to learn to live with in America. We can’t stop it so why even talk about it. And why even try —- the numbers of mass murders, even in America which owns this market, are so low that you will never even be able to prove that what you did, did anything positive, or negative, ever.
Now if you widen the problem to include other gun violence in America, you might have something. If we included mass shootings at 2 people or more and mass shootings where 4 or more people are shot, but 4 do not die, or even one-on-one shootings, now you have numbers that one might address IF one was so inclined. I am not.
I think Joe is wrong that somehow a gruesome execution will solve the problem. First, the problem is bounded by mass murder which is bounded by the FBI definition of 4 dead. Horrific as it is, the numbers are incredibly low. We could reduce far more child-deaths if we just donated to Ukrainian relief funds. The numbers are that low. The entire situation changes is you define as minimum of two dead, mass shooting where multiple shot but not 4 dead, or even rampage shootings which are defined by multiple dead at multiple locations, which the Texas murder would technically fall into.
If we are looking at mass murder, using FBI definition, around 50% off themselves or are killed by police. So, it’s a very small number of potential executions which is cut in half by death. One outcome of Joe’s Law might be that the 50% dead just rises to 100% once they know what’s waiting for them IF they survive. Could just increase the total mortality rate if shooter survival is not a viable option. If Joe thinks that somehow a gruesome ending would convince suicidal people not to commit suicide, I think he’s looking for an emotional response that won’t be there. These are not survival type people Joe. They don’t have your feelings and emotions.
Second, for those people thinking if we arm the schools, it will help. Probably not, there are soft targets in many public settings. Too many meaning your solution is basically to be armed. And this was Texas, you don’t think the school was armed? Each case is different, investigations need to be done, but in this case, one report said there were police on the scene of the crash confronting the shooter before he entered the school. There was a challenge by a school official, was he armed? And then the police took hours to shoot the guy, why hours? Many questions on this one re: the timeline and the police response. But, statistically, if the schools became armed camps, too many other soft targets as alternatives in public settings meaning basically what you are talking about is the old West, without the deadline. Ah, the memories…….
Last, when Joe says “Someone can do close to the same damage with a knife or a car, it would just change the fashion, not the attitude” he is probably not correct. There are lethality indexes proving that other methods are just not as lethal as guns because they are not as easily accessed, used, and have less probability for death when used. For example, guns and suicide are almost always perfect. Drugs, hammers, axes, chainsaws, poison, knives, ropes, cars, not so much so. Much easier to fuck it up when you choose anything beyond a gun. It’s still easier to pull the trigger than to jump off a bridge. And recidivism is low. Therefore, when you screw up with the drugs, hanging yourself, slashing your wrists, etc., chances are you won’t do it again. Therefore, if guns somehow magically disappeared from America, suicide numbers would fall. Same is true for almost any other gun crime. It’s just that point and click is so much easier than stab, beat, and throttle. And it has a very high lethality index — if you point and click and hit the target, good chance the target is dead. Knives, etc. —- less chance of death even if you hit the target. At least that’s what lethality experts say. Especially in that narrow window known as the FBI definition of mass murder.
Bottom line is we will probably do nothing here.
Perhaps the only thing to be done is to stop reporting on it so much, quit using the murderers name, just avoid the whole thing as we avoid the mass murder to begin with. Quit offering political solutions like prayers for the dead. They’re dead, prayers haven’t helped. Quit demanding we put some limits on guns and who owns them. There’s too many out there already, stop trying. Like covid, let’s just mask up, block the whole thing out, and get on with our lives. This stuff just is part of our freedom in America, so let’s move on.
But I applaud Joe for at least being a Trumplicant that attempts to find a solution. Perhaps he should opine on gun violence solutions for the wider problem than mass murder which is gun death in America, homicide, suicide, mass, assault, robbery, dispute, and abuse crimes. Perhaps Joe has some solutions there too although I hope gruesome executions would not be one of them.
First, I didn’t say execution, you need to pay attention to what you read. Execution was not the point.
Second, I guarantee you that plowing into a crowd with an f150 will kill as many people as you want.
So you are advocating giving up both the 1st and 4th amendments? Great. Russia and China don’t have those, and they want you.
If anyone ask me why I need a certain kind of a gun I ask why a free American has to explain why I need anything.
I like it.
Kenny, you’re not free and having a gun doesn’t make you any freer. You are a slave to capitalism and the cult of conservatism.
Women would also like to ask the same question, as an American, why do they have to justify their medical decisions they made with their doctors to Republican politicians?
Uh oh. A commie pretending to be Larry
Sorry, it was hard to ferret out your mealy-mouthed weasel-worded passage. Let’s see: you call for “xx” Basically you want a vigilante, or squad, to assassinate anyone involved in a mass murder including law officers. Let’s see, one guy executed in front of witnesses, one guy dismembered and videotaped that he shows to others, later a “private” car bomb, next target, which does not happen, is City Hall. Nope, sounds pretty public to me….. And only God and you seem to know what “wiki” methods are. Yawn.
“Second, I guarantee you that plowing into a crowd with an f150 will kill as many people as you want.” And that’s the fallacy of anecdotal data. You can envision that it happens, therefore it is. You have seen it in your mind’s eye. You have heard other cases from the media. Yes, it can be done but if we compared mass murders by gun versus auto/truck, you would come up woefully short on the numbers. Mass murders are rare. Mass murders by auto/truck extremely rare, statistically insignificant.
The Michigan SUV killer hit 20 people out of a crowd of hundreds. A total of 5 died out of a target pool of hundreds. Imagine if he stood in the crowd’s middle with a Glock 9mm with 33 in the clip. The Toronto Truck killer nailed 11 with a van. Again, there were hundreds present and the rampage went on for a number of blocks.
Trumplicants have rammed BLM protests about 140 times. One drove his truck into a crowd, result was one guy in a wheelchair. Think the entire punchline was 4 dead, over 100 injured. Not exactly the tale of a gun.
My point is vehicles can be used, they are currently the darling of right-wing zealots after being highlighted on the web. Funny how they have adopted the tactics of Muslim extremists. And when being used, results can be horrific. But they most often are not.
“So you are advocating giving up both the 1st and 4th amendments? Great. Russia and China don’t have those, and they want you.” Trying to pick a fight? You know I said nothing of the sort. I said: “I tire of the haranguing on both sides……… Enough. Like covid, it’s just a disease we need to learn to live with in America. We can’t stop it so why even talk about it. And why even try —- the numbers of mass murders, even in America which owns this market, are so low that you will never even be able to prove that what you did, did anything positive, or negative, ever.” Did you hear the recommendation or request for Constitutional change? Of course not, you embellish without cause, again, like all Trumplicants……or at least that’s how to roll the dice across the aisle to us. “All dems are the same, they all want……” BS.
Like all Trumplicants, there are 21 dead in Texas by gun, mostly children two days from summer recess, and you want to talk about the Constitution…….
Here’s the deal you ignorant prick. I’m not going to surrender my guns to the government or anyone else. Much of these commie gun control laws are nothing but knee jerk reactions. We need people armed in public. We need properly trained staff at schools. Why do we have to be sitting ducks Violence is here and it’s not going anywhere. The government should stay out of the way of self defense because they don’t always protect us. All of our states and territories should have strong constitutional carry laws. Yes, I believe in good guys with guns. I’m one of them. I read that the Hollywood fat ass Michael Moore is calling for a repeal of the 2nd amendment. Ok , tell us fat ass Mikey. Are you willing to give up your celebrity security? The crazy son of a bitch in Texas had already had several red flags and still passed a background check. That’s bullshit!!!! Crazy people and felons should be put away for several years if they touch a gun. But I’m fucking sick and tired of average law abiding citizens being demonized by commie bastards that refuse to do a damned thing about the blood running in the streets of Chicago and New York and other major cities ran by brain dead democrats. In New York they put them people back on the streets and most of the time they hurt other people. A great start would also be to enforce the laws already on the books and prosecute the violent criminals. Re: my post about removing some of the gun laws are aimed at the laws hindering people from becoming victims.
Wtf are you squawking about you loon. I don’t want your guns, new lWs, or anything. Learn how to read jackass.
Frank, pay attention. These people are already suicidal. Assassination is just another road to glory. It’s what happens in the interim that they need to know.
You are right, I have never plowed an f150 into a crowd myself. And the glock would probably kill about the same number of people. You obviously have no experience with guns and moving targets.
I’ll stand by what I said on the 1st and 4th, sorry if it is too fast for you to follow.
Thanks for the advice Joe. So your solution has a 50% opportunity for the entire set, 50% will escape via death and all your target needs to do is complete the suicide they intended to avoid your penalty. Sounds like a stupid idea easily defeated without much additional effort whatsoever. All they have to do to avoid your punishment is to complete their intended act you admit they desire.
FYI, based on results, guns kill many more than F150 trucks. It’s a dumb comparison.
And most everything I shoot, moves. Except for punching holes in your stories, I usually choose tougher moving targets. But if I am looking to kill numbers in a crowd, the gun is more efficient and effective. You can drive instead. If trucks were such great killings machines, we’d give the infantry 150’s and not AK’s.
No, guns don’t kill anyone. Cain killed Abel with a rock, but God didn’t blame the rock.
So now you are an expert on mass killings? The rest of your rant is gratuitous BS.
Is that your verbal manner of sticking your head up your ass? When you can’t come with the factual goods, you get personal. Sorry Koe, I don’t want to dance.
I did not blame the gun. I just said it is more efficient and effective thus more lethal than other alternatives. You would be an idiot to think otherwise. Oh wait, you did. Never mind.
40 minutes police stood outside while the shooter killed. They expended more energy keeping parents from engaging the shooter than they did neutralizing the situation. And then lied about their actions.
I guess the SCOTUS nailed it when they said the police were under no obligation to protect us.
That’s why we must protect ourselves. The police come on the scene and draw your shape with a piece of chalk. But you’re still dead
Police SWAT ( standing around acting tough)
Back the blue!!!
Do you have a better idea?
Roy, thanks for asking! I do. Make all guns illegal unless you are in a WELL REGULATED militia recognized by the FEDERAL government.
Conduct a gun buy back with a 25% mark up with 6 months to comply. After 6 months we withhold tax returns and freeze bank accounts until there is compliance.
Then we make mental health care a fundamental right of being a U.S. citizen. Anyone that wants to see someone will be able to immediately.
Or we could just limit the number of doors in each school and eliminate any windows a potential shooter could shoot into, train and pay armed guards at each and every school in America ( although we know that doesn’t work)
Or hear me out… we could have universal back ground checks. Totally ban military assault type weapons and high capacity magazines, you know, common sense stuff that 80% of Americans agree with.
I wouldn’t comply.
You wouldn’t have access to money.
Let’s use some common sense here.
What is the common denominator here for all these school shootings?
People kill people, not external objects.
All shooters have predicted their behavior online or to others.
Most, if not all have been bullied.
They all have learned to hate! Hate is a learned behavior!
They do not value innocent human life.
The antidote is simple: A psychological interview by any competent psychologist could filter these people. A 15 minute Psych interview would go a long way for many gun buyers. Especially single males.
The flaw in your argument is that while most shooters telegraph their moves on social media, tens of thousands say such bullshit on social media and never act on it. And who decides who needs a psych interview? The Democrats would say that all Republicans need one, and vice versa.
The solution in the article transmits the consequences and changes the psychological dynamic. Instead of being a folk hero, as they now think they are portrayed, they risk suffering and humiliation in the extreme.
“hi, I am here for my psyche interview.”
“Sure. I’m Dr. Joe. One question: do you feel crazy.”
“No.”
“OK then. As part of Dr. Joe’s introductory interview, here’ your free, fully loaded, 9mm. Just pick it up when you get your receipt. Today’s session will be $2,022.”
LARRY — IT’S A JOKE LARRY. IT’S A JOKE.
This sounds like Operation Rendition used by the Military & CIA to interrogate ISIS captures in Afgahnistan. Hmmm, video & social media publishing of “Renditioning” mass shooters, of their torturing the shooter to gain a clear idea of the WHY he did the killing just might have a deterent effect. But, as you say, unconstitutional, but no more so than the “Civil Property Siezure Acts” of suspected drug lords. If you thought the Libs screamed loudly about arming school staffs (not just teachers), just wait until you hear the cries and see the crodile tears for “renditioning”.
It would have to be vigilante, not government… But it would work.