Biden’s farewell speech not like Johnson’s
We hear a lot about the similarity between President Johnson’s withdrawal speech and President Biden’s. Other than the fact that both Johnson and Biden ended their campaigns for reelection in the face of a potential defeat, there are no similarities.
Johnson faced political reality when he was losing ground to the competition in the Democratic primaries – most notably from Minnesota Senator Eugene McCarthy. Biden breezed through the Democratic primaries but later faced the growing realization among party leaders over his odds of getting reelected were zero.
Reading the writing on the wall, Johnson gave up early – and without any apparent pressure from Democrat colleagues. Johnson stepped aside more than three months before the Democratic National Convention. That left time for real competition in the remaining primaries – mostly between McCarthy and New York Senator Robert Kennedy, who entered the race and seemed to be on his way to the nomination when he was assassinated.
On the other hand, Biden remained adamant in his pursuit of a second term – even after his disastrous debate and after virtually the entire Democrat establishment publicly called on him to step down. Although it was Biden’s decision to make, he did not exit the stage voluntarily – or out of a sense of public good. He reluctantly succumbed to insurmountable pressure from political leaders and donors — and the realization that he was going to lose badly and hand the Senate, House and down ballot offices to the Republicans.
While Johnson was in trouble in terms of his election numbers, they were not so bad that he could not have won. Where Biden was clinging to his bid tenaciously, Johnson seemed tired and unwilling to carry on. That is why Johnson’s withdrawal came as a surprise and Biden’s was inevitable. Johnson could have won, Biden could not. At least that was the consensus of top Democrats.
Also, there was no question of Johnson’ physical and mental ability to campaign and serve another four years. Biden’s mental decline — that was seen by political insiders and the general public — was the political coup de grâce. By all measures, Biden was losing to Trump before the debate – and according to top Democrat sources — was being crushed by Trump following the debate. The narrative that Biden was the only person who could beat Trump was no longer remotely believable.
Even their speeches were remarkably different. Johnson was resolute, firm and specific, while Biden’s tended to reflect his weakened condition. His voice was weak. He had the demeanor of an old man. There was not vigor.
Johnson is remembered more for his accomplishments than his withdrawal – whether people liked them or not. He presided over the 1964 Civil Rights Act and the 1965 Voting Rights Act. He launched the Great Society, the War on Poverty and passed Medicare. These are all actions of enormous historical significance.
As I noted in a previous commentary, Biden lacks any accomplishments that are likely to stand up to the test of time. The Infrastructure Bill, the Chips Bill and the so-called Inflation Reduction Act –his greatest achievements — loom large today, but pale when compared to the truly monumental and historic achievements of many previous presidents – including Obama, Reagan, Nixon, Franklin Roosevelt and a dozen earlier from further in the past.
Biden said he was withdrawing for the good of the country, but he was not specific on what harm would result from his carrying on. Was it simply that he could not beat Trump? Was it his recognition that his manifest aging issue would prevent him from carrying out the duties of the office?
Many Democrat leaders still allege that Biden does not have a mental acuity problem. That it was simply a pragmatic issue of losing to Trump.
It can be fairly debated whether Biden could have – or would have – beaten Trump. But all indicators suggested that he was poised not only for defeat but a catastrophic drubbing.
In his speech, Biden offered platitudes, but no specific reason why he decided to withdraw. But … he had previously said that he would only end his campaign if he had a health problem, or he could not win. As it turned out, he had a health problem AND could not win.
Yes, both Johnson’s and Biden’s decisions were dramatic, but Johnson is best remembered for what he achieved. Biden has done nothing that will hold the attention of history,
So, there ‘tis.
Did anyone see the article reported by a major news source that democrats are more likely to be child predators? Can’t remember which one but someone might have heard it
Great facts with references Frank! Yes, I had to read the Indy joke a few times! LOL
It would have been nice if Seth had supplied some references.
Hey Frank and Seth, I found an article by what I consider to be a very right leaning GOP paper called the Guardian. The article is titled, “The Republican party is obsessed with children – in the creepiest of ways. This article supports Franks statistics and seems to contradict Seth. Sorry Seth.
Seth: why didn’t you look? This study concludes: “In other words, if a county had a higher proportion of Trump voters than Biden voters, there were generally higher reports of child abuse” but it’s weak. *https://www.rightandfreedom.com/blog/child-abuse-vs-political-leaning*
For fun, I pulled the Wiki list of federal sex crimes *https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_federal_political_sex_scandals_in_the_United_States* and using a rough scale of the words Democrat and Republican to see who’s who in this zoo. 67 Republican occurrences and 48 Democrat. Also, 4,358 Independents.
Ok, now that Tom’s head blew off, just kidding no Indy’s. :>)
OK, now for some more fun: here’s the quick fact set for sexual abuse: mostly white men, go figure: *https://www.ussc.gov/sites/default/files/pdf/research-and-publications/quick-facts/Sexual_Abuse_FY21.pdf*
Here’s party affiliation by gender: *https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2024/04/09/partisanship-by-gender-sexual-orientation-marital-and-parental-status/#:~:text=Among%20all%20registered%20voters%2C%20men,%25%20Republican%2C%20including%20leaners).*
Uh oh, Republican party leans towards men. Not gay men, the other kind…..
Then, party by race: *https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2024/04/09/partisanship-by-race-ethnicity-and-education/#:~:text=As%20has%20long%20been%20the,Black%20voters%20remain%20overwhelmingly%20Democratic.*
Uh oh,, Republican party leans towards white.
So, most child abuse by white men, most Republicans are white men. Correlation is not causation, but Seth, this does not look good. The only stories I can find about Democrats being pedo’s comes from the ragged right and is heavy on the anecdotes and light on factual evidence.
Great facts with references Frank! Yes, I had to read the Indy joke a few times! LOL
It would have been nice if Seth had supplied some references.
Hey Frank and Seth, I found an article by what I consider to be a very right leaning GOP paper called the Guardian. The article is titled, “The Republican party is obsessed with children – in the creepiest of ways. This article supports Franks statistics and seems to contradict Seth. Sorry Seth.
This story should have never been penned. Given these two men quit the race, there MUST be similarities as well as differences.
But Johnson decided to go, Joe had a lot of help. Both have broken hearts, both for different reasons.
You got what you asked for, why do you need more? You can’t mend a broken heart, but is it really profitable to keep trampling it? Five months as lame duck, let it go.
Lucky you Frank! You burn in eternity with your Delaware potato and Dick Head LBJ.
I agree with you on Biden having help. But I also think Johnson had a super nudge from CBS News and their reporter Walter Cronkite. Walter aired his damning report on Vietnam on Feb 17, of 1968. Johnson’s swan song speech was aired March 1, 1968. I remember both days very well. Johnson was wildly unpopular because he ramped up troops in Vietnam to 512,000 total. Protests and burning monks were everywhere. South Vietnam’s new leadership had the old leadership shot in the back of a van while taking them to the airport. I seem to remember an article ran first by one of the major newspapers that was titled, “Johnson’s War Plans Proven Faulty”. IT was one big cluster f%&* of a time! And Nixon was pounding on Johnson to end the war. Young people were moving to Canada.
Johnson had plenty of help.
Back then we only had newspapers and tv as our info sources. And tv had 12 VHF channels and UHF was just coming out with 6 additional channels. There was no broadband, public internet, social media was church and civic activities/groups. And you always carried a dime in case you needed to make a phone call!!! AT&T was a “sanctioned monopoly” back then! MCI was decades away. LOL And Archie Bunker thinking was prevalent. Ahhhhhh, those were the days!!! LOL
Well, if you can’t argue the facts, attack the person.
Well done, comrade krinkov, may your kindness be returned to you ten fold.
Frank Stetson ….Coming from PBP’s numero uno attack dog and gold medalist hypocrite, that is rich. LOL
Horist: I am sure you know that two wrongs will never make it right.
On this thread you have launched a multitude of snice personal attacks. I have launched none. You slammed AC, attempted to shame Tom.
This article gets a Stop The Spin rating of STS = 1. Its fairly factual but leaves out one very critical fact about Johnson.
First of all, as a matter of comparison, the times these two men were presidents in are very different. If there had been commercial internet (internet back then was for military and large defense companies only) Johnson may very well have been forced out of his campaign as well. Tricky Dicky Nixon was going to kick his ass anyway.
Larry seems to have forgotten Johnson’s #1 problem that overshadowed all of the great accomplishments of his administration. Not sure why Larry would forget to mention this – maybe his mind is slipping away as well. Walter Cronkite aired on CBS on Feb 17, 1968, and came across with his earth shattering report (I watched it with my parents) that the Vietnam War was not win-able and would end in a stalemate. See ole Walt at *https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dn2RjahTi3M*. Cronkite had just gotten back from Vietnam where he talked with many high level officials. Johnson got sucked into a Kennedy Administration hold over named McNamara who believed that we could fight a statistical war in Vietnam, and that eventually the North would run out of people and resources. Well, he blew it big time, and in 1967 gave Johnson a real headache over his request for many new troops to win the war, about 200,000 he estimated would be needed. And the budget would have to be greatly increased for his social programs and the war – and Johnson did not want to tell the American people this fact. Johnson’s solution for the budget was what came to be called the “Unified Budget” which basically allowed the Social Security locked box budget to be merged with the Federal general budget. Johnson had initiated this unified accounting approach in 1968 but did not officially sign it into law until 5 days before he left office in Jan 1969. Nixon was the first to have full access to it. For a complete history of SSA budget treatment, see *https://www.ssa.gov/history/BudgetTreatment.html* . Its an interesting read.
Larry, how could you forget about Johnson’s one huge negative that overshadowed all of his positives???
Tom….How is life in fantasyland? You rebuttal is that IF the Internet had existed in Johnson’s time, he MAY have been forced out of the campaign. Hey …he was forced out You thinking is a fantasy. If we had television at the time of Lincoln, maybe he would have have watched the play from home. Come on, man. That is incredibly stupid speculation to create a false argument. My commentary dealt with the comparative facts … not your imagined speculation. It was not a commentary about the impact of the war on Johnson. You rebut by changing the subject … if you even grasped the subject.
Secondly, I was dealing with his ACCOMPLISHMENETS compared to Biden’s. It was not a summary of his administration. You miss the point of the commentary … as usual.
Life is great Larry! How is it in Spinville?
Larry, allow me to expand your mind a little past your ridiculous spin. Accomplishments can be positive or negative! A failure of accomplishment is also a form of accomplishment – negative accomplishment. And written English allows for the use of the term.
1) Being one of the most wildly unpopular presidents in US history IS AN ACCOMPLISHMENT!!!
2) Ramping up the Vietnam war to 512,000 IS AN ACCOMPLISHMENT!!!
3) Screwing up the Vietnam War with faulty war plans (statistical war approach) IS AN ACCOMPLISHMENT!!!
4) Unlocking a previously locked social security fund box without the consent of the depositors IS AN ACCOMPLISHMENT!!!
Larry, if you look further down at my later comments, I did suggest that Johnson was also forced out.
LARRY, GREAT JOB AT NOT ADDRESSING YOUR FAILURE TO MENTION THE VIETNAM WAR THAT OVERSHADOWED ALL OF HIS POSITIVE ACCOMPLISHMENTS WHICH WAS THE WHOLE REASON FOR HIS SPEECH IN THE FIRST PLACE!!!! How could you forget to address Johnson’s horrible performance on the Vietnam war which was the reason he was forced out!!!
AGAIN I SAY: “Shame on you Larry for even suggesting Johnson had more class than Biden.” In doing this, you show the idiot you really are!!!
And by the way Larry, Johnson is most remembered for screwing up Vietnam and getting a lot of my generation killed! When most of us think of Johnson, our first thought and second are how he screwed up Vietnam and got a lot of my generation killed! I have never heard a single one of us say, “Johnson has more class than Biden”, nor has anyone bothered to mention any of the accomplishments you mention because Vietnam overshadowed all of them!!! Just because history books remember those accomplishments does not mean the people remember him for that!
I am sometimes amazed at how out of touch you really are. And again, Johnson’s speech was primarily about South East Asia and a memory lane walk of his government career. Nothing visionary in it, just one or two lines.
My, my…. Tommy is gets a little testy when his foolishness and dishonesty is exposed. And such childish name calling, Tsk! Tsk! The commentary is about the two withdrawal speeches. Your pent up rage over Vietnam and your hate for Johnson is just spleen venting. I never said that Johnson had more class than Biden. (Maybe you meant “ass.”) I am not a fan of many of Johnson’s policies as President, but I can still see them as far more important in terms of history than Biden. You think folks 50 years from now will be talking about Biden fixing a few bridges? LOL. If they remember anything, I might be his disastrous surrender in Afghanistan or the Present that presided over a nasty inflation era. Or the only President forced out for mental acuity reasons. And personally, I doubt that even those will give Biden any long-term hold on history.
Tom, agreed to most of your points and find your take very interesting. From my standpoint, LBJ was a very complex guy. While racist in speech, dislike of elites like Kennedy he thought looked down upon him, and even that his chair on Air Force One was raised so that this towering man would even tower more above anyone across the desk. Weird guy.
IMO, Johnson knew he fucked up in Vietnam, he knew he was fucking up when he did it, and I believe he quit the race from a broken heart over that which then killed him in a few years. Well, he passed much great legislation, as Horist indicated, I agree with you that Vietnam is a giant boat anchor on any of his accomplishments.
However, on your treatment of Social Security, the way the Social Security has been funded, and the way that the funds are tapped has been about the same ever since the fun began. That is, we take any excess funds, and we put it into special bills. Therefore, Social Security basically is the largest funder of our debt, which means it funds anything that Congress comes up with to spend money on. No one actually taps the fund, the fund just becomes the revenue of bonds. No different than if you and I go out and buy savings bonds.
What lbj did was move the accounting to a unified budget, or what they called on~budget. It just put all the numbers together. It didn’t change how funded or how spent. The only way the Social Security is spent is paying off the subscriber. The only way that it is invested is within treasury securities, which then fund whatever the government wants to do. And the treasury securities are always paid back to the Social Security fund with interest. Pretty good interest too.
Meanwhile, over the years after Johnson did this, the fund has gone on budget and off budget a couple of times. Frankly, I could care less either way. It’s just an accounting mechanism does not change the funding or the spending which are mandated by law.
Some folks want us to manage our own funds within Social Security instead of the current process. The problem with that is that first citizens would be picking winners and losers in the market out of a prescribe set of funds where the government would pick the prescribe of fund winners and losers. Second, and much more important, it has been proven that overtime, on average, citizenswill not do as well as the current process.
The actual way that Social Security is invested is unique highlighting the special advantages, sovereign nation accounting can have over the individual. I think it’s really cool.
By the way Larry, most of Johnson’s speech was about 1) the Vietnam war history and current state, 2) his personal history; and had nothing to do with his decision to not seek the nomination. Read his speech at *https://www.historyplace.com/speeches/lbj-decision.htm*. He only had one paragraph (at the end) about not seeking the nomination. By comparison, Biden’s speech was visionary and self reflective with a willingness to admit others were better equipped and younger, and should now carry the torch. Johnson gave his speech on March 1, 1968, just twelve days after Walter Cronkite shocked Johnson and the nation with his blockbuster CBS newscast about the war being unwinnable. I think Cronkite forced Johnson’s hand. This is the power of the media when they are not in the tank for any particular party. This is the way our founders set it up to be.
Tom …Are you trying to say that the primary purpose of LBJ’s speech was NOT his withdrawal? That was just an incidental side comment? The war was the predicate, but stepping down was the purpose of the speech. Suggesting otherwise is just unimaginably ignorant of reality. By your way of thinking, the news of November 23, 1963 was President Kennedy’s speech at a congressional fundraiser — after which he was incidentally assassinated. Your contrarian obsession is making you sound goofy.
Tom … You are repeating yourself — and making no more sense the second time around. Not a good sign.
Cherry pick through history and you got busted.
Research and memory serves telling a different story’s ending.
I know you lived through that time but your memory seems bookish. Don’t you recall the Vietnam (conflict)War being existentially critical for men. College graduation certificate arrived in the mail same day with draft notice that said time for physical and induction. You ever get asked, what did you do in the war daddy. We all were told, forget about the war, get in with your life. PSD don’t matter
Be thankful you came home whole and alive.
No one wanted any stories and we didn’t need them told.
The nation dried up in shame at withdrawing without victory.
Johnson, bless his little Texas heart, hung his head and did not support our troops with all they needed.
Blame whoever was directing information flow and stretching out the time to reward the military and business profits being pocketed.
Who became wealthy at the expense of men POW’s, dead, crippled, and traumatized.
What were you when the country was crying blood in battle and on streets in Detroit, Watts,Chicago, New York. Birmingham and more.
Big man in DC giving Nixon aid and comfort.
Nixon possibly accomplished two positives.
He resigned and the draft ended so quotas were filled with volunteers.
Larry, Biden will be remembered positively during a difficult decade made worse by his predecessor, ol’ 45. You point your dementia handicapped fingers at Biden and delude yourself thinking you are more capable. I doubt you are, but if you are. You won’t be for too long. It like a speeding fraught train headed your way.
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Yes I remember those times very well AC. I remember watching that speech. My brother and I shared a large bedroom. We were both lying on our beds watching our 12 channel Admiral TV. We watched the speech and wondered if LBJ was gonna get us deeper into Vietnam and send us. I was digging through old records the other day and actually found my draft registration card. I agree. Johnson left with head bowed in shame, like a dog with its tail between its legs. Biden left on a high note sacrificing his ambitions for the sake of party and country unity – a high note. Jill and the family were by his side in the address. Lady Bird was out spreading flower seeds by the roadsides. Many differences.
Larry’s only mistake in this article was publishing it so that we older guys who lived through those days could remind him how it really was for the guys who could not get college deferments, health deferments (like Trump), or lived in poverty. Most likely Larry had a college deferment and then went to work for Nixon where he was able to avoid breaking a nail much less going to boot camp!!!
Tom … why do you make up stories out of your malignant imagination? I did not have a college deferment …and did go to Army boot camp. I did not serve in Vietnam, however;. And I would never say I did like Senator Blumenthal falsely claimed. And I did not go from college to the Nixon White House. There was a four year gap in which I held various non-political jobs. You make up that imaginary Larry Horist as a straw man and lie, … lie …lie. Your abounding arrogance is superseded by your lack of intellectual integrity. The only think you are independent of is … honesty.
Larry, this article is a supreme example of how you “spin by omission”!! First you cherry pick Johnson’s accomplishments while listing none of Bidens like expanded insulin programs, and rebuilding infrastructure will go down in history as a great accomplishment! Also getting our chip producing firms back on shore will be big as well. Then you omit Johnson’s major faults. Credible accounts, reveal LBJ engaged in racist acts, including verbal abuse and surveillance of blacks. Credible accounts, however, revealed LBJ engaged in racist acts, including verbal abuse and surveillance. He had a strong affinity for racial stereotypes and antiblack slurs. As he fought to desegregate schools and unlock educational and economic opportunities for Black people, he routinely berated his Black employees, calling them “furniture.” He was a failure in Vietnam which was a much larger failure than Trump/Biden in Afghanistan. Then you take and hold up this Dem Johnson as someone good and use him to bash Biden who what this Independent considers a much better presidency where he ended a war and did not get us directly into another. You fail to mention the communications differences between the two eras. Had Johnson been subjected to the internet, social media, etc. his already wild unpopularity would have been 100 times worse!!! Johnson did not have to deal with China like Biden had too after Trump lost a trade war and damaged relations.
You eliminated all of the dirty truth about Johnson. There are some people who feel LBJ may have had as many as 11 people eliminated. You can google Malcolm Wallace for more insight into these allegations. The book by Barr McClelland has a copy of a communication between Lyndon Johnson and his lawyer and expediter Ed Clark that seems to discuss the need to murder one of LBJ’s enemies. That person was murdered shortly after. The only time Malcolm Wallace was caught he was sentenced to life in prison by a jury. Johnson arranged for the judge to set aside that verdict and change it to 5 years’ probation. Once the trial was over Johnson arranged for Wallace to get a management job with LTV and a top-secret classification. Read more at *https://www.quora.com/What-crime-was-LBJ-being-indicted-for-in-1963* and see just how dirty this man was!
In one of my previous posts within this article I posted the address of Johnson’s speech so you could read it. It is mostly about South East Asia and about Johnson’s memories of his employment in government – but he did not mention that he was being investigated for a murder and many other crimes he may have had a hand in down in TX before the election. Had Kennedy not been shot, Johnson’s future may have been much different!
Shame on you Larry for even suggesting Johnson had more class than Biden. This shows just how much you hate Biden and the lengths you will go through to beat a dead horse!!! This is why you need me and others to keep you honest and present both sides. We will make you a more conscientious writer!
It’s screwy. Larry a self described conservative Republican launches into a comparo of two Democratic presidents some 70 years separate. First, Republicans are by definition negatively biased and unreliable commentators on subjects that involve democrat, especially DEM presidents. Second, Larry is continuing his ultra obsessive peeve on with Biden. Larry, Biden is not running for reelection. He is president until January, I am aware that you will happily beat down the phantom Biden you imagine.
Third, your memory about LBJ has the appearance of Swiss cheeses. It is full of holes, highly processed, and serviced with crackers.
Forth, employing Johnson and his farewell speech as a bludgeon against Biden is a swing and a miss that goes whoosh. Embarrassing I’d say. You believe your opinion is always on point and unassailable. Reality check, facts don’t match with truth. Your opinions appear dated and out of step.
Fifth, on one common trait all Republicans share is a dark negativity, you possess in spades, You and your right wing friends directly target those who you prejudge are wrong because of stupidity.
Truth is political party preference and stupidity do not directly correlate. Before Trump invented the conspiracy theory known as MAGA stupidity happened without respect for political preference.. These days in America the MAGAites define stupidity greater than. Ignorance alone.
You will not find political madness in the Democratic Party like those marching to MAGA’s drum beat.
Biden is a better president than LBJ no matter what you misrepresent his record to be.
Living through that period we had division in politics about Vietnam. If your memory is intact which side were you on, Hawk or Dove. We who had skin in the war wanted the end to war and return home as a Dove is for peace. Hawks demanded more involvement, increase draftees count, reduce the country to a parking lot, leave nothing standing.
Yet Kissinger kept talking negotiation and it came to no effect. Paris talks were a bust.
Which were you, Hawk or Dove. Republicans were Hawkish, profiting from selling military products.
.
All very good points. Based on Larry’s opinions on Iran, Houthis, etc. and what the U.S. should do, Larry is definitely a hawk. He does not mind getting other people’s children killed in far away lands. Just as he prefers calling people names instead of debating the issues. Larry feels he is always correct. He is a legend in his own mind. A failed writer desperately looking for acknowledgement and appreciation from his chosen few who will agree with his spin and lies.
Tommy ..Tommy. You have descended into the realm of contemptibility I am a Gold Star grandfather … as you know. So save your vulgar sanctimonious attacks on my opinion of the sacrifice these young people make. Sorry you feel so defeated as to descend to such a mean-spirited gutter level. And you finish with a litany of baseless and ignorant attacks based on the Larry Horist invented by your intellectually challenged mind. Even with all your obvious arrogance, your now revealed despicability surprises me.
AC … You are rambling again old man. But, you got me on the last point. “… profiting from selling military products,” I was around that time that I sold an 1870’s rifle I inherited. I never said that Johnson was “better” than Biden — just far more accomplished in terms of hold on history than Biden. No amount of contemporary partisan puffing old Biden up will change that.
By the way .. I spent a lot of time with the top aide to the last S. Vietnamese president and a principle negotiator for the Paris Peace talks. I was also at the White House as the war was winding down. Meaning …. I will rely more on my first hand information and experience than your armchair fading memory,
Ac … Are you totally out of touch with reality? You say I launched into “a comparo of two Democratic presidents some 70 years separate.”
I did not launch into that comparison…that has been made by scores of commentators over the past few weeks. Have you been dozing off?. I just gave it a fuller perspective. And as far as the rest of your commentary … you seem to live in a world of old narratives and biases. Just a lot of new whine in an old bottle.