The end is near … at least for the moment
On the eve of the election, the only thing of any relevancy is what we do not know. Among the no longer relevant are the last minute public statements … the various partisan narratives … the opinions of pundits … the results of polls. Whatever influence they may have had on the election is already baked into the minds of the voters.
Several decades of political involvement have led me to a basic truth. If your side wins, things will never be as good as you had hoped. And if your side loses, it will never be as bad as you feared.
At this point, no one … as in NO ONE … knows who will win the 2024 presidential election. We can all have our desires. We can also look at minuscule hints based on uncertain statistics, historical facts and gut instinct. But never has there been a presidential contest that is so close by every pre-election measure – in the popular vote and in every one of the so-called battleground states.
At this point, we do not even know how long it will take to know who has been elected by we the people – at least half of us. We certainly have no idea who will eventually win at least 270 votes in the Electoral College – although we can rest assured that one of the candidates will. It now all depends on approximately half the nation’s voters who will cast their ballots on election day and close out campaign 2024.
What we can know is that regardless of who wins, America will remain America – the greatest democratic Republic in history – and at the same time a sharply divided nation. Neither President Trump nor Vice President Harris are unifying candidates. Either will lead from their partisan and philosophic bases. The principles, passions and issues that have increasingly divided America over recent decades will continue – and will remain to be the subject of divisive national dialogue and debate for the foreseeable future.
When such stark division will end — and America will again be the UNITED States — is the biggest unknown of all. In the meantime, stay calm and be happy to be living in America where political division is a fundamental right.
So, there ‘tis.
Talk about jumping the shark. How many it’s over stories can run before Tuesday?
The author should at least offer some insights.
When will we know who won via media results? Tuesday/Weds day, or beyond?
Who will attempt to throw the wooden shoe into the election cogs and will it stop the vote?
Who will exhibit more violence if violence is to rule the day?
Will Joe send thousands to the Capitol, declare martial law, and remain in office until he goes to that chamber in the sky?
Will Don go to jail on 11/26 —- 50/50 chance is the current wager
I will say this: if Kamala wins, I hope we get enough of you guys in the Congress to curb the spending.
Frank aka SD …. You have one consistency …. criticizing. And I find it ironic that you criticize what you see as repetition when all you do is repeat and repeat and repeat your litany of Trump hatred talking points in long long long rants. lots of words with little to no new information. That is why I get a kick out of you — though “some folks may go for cocaine.” LOL
Always good to get personal and avoid actual issues in discussion.
You claim repetition is my personal issue this time, but cannot refute the facts. Perhaps it is you own stories that cause the repetition. Perhaps if you had moved on from your decades-old tired-old arguments, usually sans facts, and heavy on the “I said so, that’s why-isms.”
And where did I say you repeat too much, repeat too much? I said you were jumping the shark. It’s a term describing a tv sitcom situation from Happy Days. The meaning, from WIKI: “Jump the shark” is a term that is used to argue that a creative work or entity has reached a point in which it has exhausted its core intent.”
And I am sorry that I criticize a lot; I guess you really need crowd approval but IMO, no one learns anything from that process except what you learned decades ago.
Perhaps if you argued the points, any points, beyond the personality, it would provide a more harmonious outcome. But all you got is personal attacks apparently. At least in this one. Which is a repeat of last one.
Sigh.
Again Larry, you criticize SD yet offer no answers to SD’s very legitimate questions. Maybe if you offered some answers to legitimate questions and comments you would not get so much repeat!
Actually, I jumped my own shark treating the author over time rather than being specific to his quest: does SD repeat himself. Let’s look at the facts, here’s the piece with my comment in ()’s
Talk about jumping the shark. How many it’s over stories can run before Tuesday?
(this is a first, no where in PBP can Larry find the term “jumping the shark” attributed to SD, probably no where else either)
The author should at least offer some insights.
(I may have said this before, but doubtful unless Larry knows of one, and he won’t)
When will we know who won via media results? Tuesday/Weds day, or beyond?
(Pretty obvious this is not a repeat)
Who will attempt to throw the wooden shoe into the election cogs and will it stop the vote?
(not a repeat, not even pointed)
Who will exhibit more violence if violence is to rule the day?
(ditto, not a repeat, not even pointed)
Will Joe send thousands to the Capitol, declare martial law, and remain in office until he goes to that chamber in the sky?
(really, Larry thinks I said this before?)
Will Don go to jail on 11/26 —- 50/50 chance is the current wager
(if this is a repeat, it’s after Larry posted since I just learned of the 11/26 sentencing date)
I will say this: if Kamala wins, I hope we get enough of you guys in the Congress to curb the spending.
(yet another one that Larry will never be able to prove a repeat, he can trust me on that on)
NOPE, it sure looks like Larry was heavy on the personal attack, stemming from his long past with someone named Frank Stetson, and he seems to carry the obsession to this day exhibiting itself in baseless personal attacks that, when examined, seem to be false, totally false. He got the criticism correct, maybe not this time, but usually, but as he is apt to do ——- he’s got his facts messed up and when looked at, his argument falls apart.
If Democrats win, as they did 4 years ago, the Trump fans will grin and bear it and protest
the results as they have a right to, but, it WILL end there!
If Republicans win, there will be bitching and the same protests will take place as if the Dems won.
There is one Big difference. The Democrats WILL go out of there way to destroy America and
Americans just to say I told you so even though it WILL be the Dems taking all the
lives! As history shows right this second with all the criminals entering this country, they have no
problem letting Americans die just to support their power grab!
The GOP delight in uncovering the few criminals entering illegally, ignoring the plight and international law for the rest, is contradicted by complete unwillingness to provide any solutions other than cutting taxes, blocking legislation, and eliminating government agencies, personnel, and funds needed to solve to our problems, including the border. Rhetoric matters, and the destruction of America rests not with the much more law-biding immigrants, but with the citizenry of the US, and whether they act out of fear or a desire for unity. Only one candidate expresses deep commitment to common purpose and unity. Only one candidate speaks of hit lists, firing squads, martial law, the “enemy within” and using troops against the “bad blood” within America, grabbing up voting machines and cancelling voters, and massive trade wars with the rest of the world. The DEMS didn’t pack the Supreme Court, nor do they support immunity for fraudsters and tax cheaters no matter how wealthy. We know what the other party will “fix” . . . . and “grab” . . . .
Well said TC!
That was very well said.
And said well.
Welcome to the discussion.
Oh God, another Deep State Kazarian Mafia fascist dictator working for Satan!
A stupid post. The blocked legislation included amnesty for illegal wetbacks.
You mean we need to deport the guy mowing your lawn for ten years and his 5 year old American born kids?
How about let the good ones living here forever as our neighbors we give a fine and some public service.
Have a heart and keep these good workers here
Oh yeah, only stupid fucking redneck troglodytes use the vile name wetback. You should apologize but hard to do when your head is lodged so far up your trump.
This article gets a Stop The Spin (STS) rating of a 2. Here is why:
.
First, this article was boring and said nothing new. The author, my buddy Larry, attempts to white was the events leading up to this election and conflate them all into one. But lets not let him do this!
Here is a paragraph of the article that we will discuss:
“What we can know is that regardless of who wins, America will remain America – the greatest democratic Republic in history – and at the same time a sharply divided nation. Neither President Trump nor Vice President Harris are unifying candidates. Either will lead from their partisan and philosophic bases. The principles, passions and issues that have increasingly divided America over recent decades will continue – and will remain to be the subject of divisive national dialogue and debate for the foreseeable future.”
1) “America will remain America”. WRONG! There are two distinct visions for the USA. One of those visions requires blind loyalty to one man at the top. The other vision requires loyalty to the Constitution of the USA. Larry’s statement attempts to conflate the two almost as if saying, “No big deal no matter who wins.”
2) One party is attempting to reach out to all under the flag of unity. The other party reports and fears one man and marches under the flag of loyalty to the top man.
3) Larry says, “Neither President Trump nor Vice President Harris are unifying candidates.” THIS IS PATENTLY FALSE AND A LIE. Trump has been very divisive for the past four years and has not increased his base. Harris has reached out and increased her base as evidenced (since Larry likes evidence) by the latest Iowa Survey which now has Harris leading by 3% where Trump after the Iowa caucus was leading by 18%. This only happens when a candidate increases base. And increasing base means higher levels of inclusion which is a form of unity.
4) Larry says, “Either will lead from their partisan and philosophic bases. ” THIS IS FALSE. Sure, both candidates have partisan bases that will want to be satisfied. But only one candidate has spoken of including GOP in their cabinet and reaching out to govern for all – and this is Harris. The amount to which she will include GOP sentiments is the only question. So far, her economic plan adds much less to national debt (something the GOP stresses yet does not restrain itself) as determined by all leading economists. There are many articles explaining this from Blumberg, WSJ, etc. but if you prefer to hear rather than read, go to *https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2VwNdFFCjo* and then you might want to research the Smoot-Hawley Tariff Act of 1930 which proved that a system based on tariffs will fail.
5) Larry says, “The principles, passions and issues that have increasingly divided America over recent decades will continue – and will remain to be the subject of divisive national dialogue and debate for the foreseeable future.”” TRUE!!! This is Larry’s way of saying that MAGA will not be going away and they, including Larry, intend to push MAGA philosophy and throw monkey wrenches into a Harris administration if she is elected. This is “party over country” thinking that the GOP has become well known for!!!
6) Larry concludes with “When such stark division will end — and America will again be the UNITED States”? Simple, when the GOP gets rid of MAGA and returns to the once beloved traditional GOP under Reagan and ceases to be a populist movement by a swath of ultra right wing Christian Nationalists and Reconstructionists who want to take women and this country back to the 1890’s while at the same time promoting white supremacy and belittling of ethnic groups such as Blacks, Latinos, Puerto Ricans, Africans, etc.
Now you have the truth. To destroy MAGA, you must vote against it (against GOP) in your presidential ballot, state ballot, and other down ballot choices. Its the same as how you remove cancer from the human body – by making sure you cut it all out!!!
So there ’tis Larry!!!
Tom …. You need to take your meds — and calm down. Just because you play Chicken Little doe not mean the sky is falling — or are you the Little Boy Who Cried Wolf?. Your hysterical response based on your devotion to left wing propaganda puts you in the category of a nutcase. Like so many left-wingers, you seem to believe that your opinions are facts — and the opinions of others are lies. When God handed out arrogance you must have gone back for seconds…or maybe thirds. .lol
Larry, as an Independent, my opinions are always fact based. Just because my comments tend to favor or lean to the Dem side of the spectrum does not mean you have to show your immense ignorance by thinking I am left or liberal. Not true. Can you not read that I advocated for the GOP to return to its sensibilities and remake itself back into a traditional GOP/Reagan party? If you want to talk about hysterical responses, just read your response to me! You are scared to answer any of my comments! You are like Trump, you run and hide from intelligence.
Larry you are the most consistent of all of us!! You always criticize the responder and never address good talking points within the responses! Shame on you. You are not a journalist, you are the epitomy of chicken by avoiding respondent talking points. Your responses consistently tell readers you are rigid and unaccepting of most comments unless such comments align with your outdated personal philosophy! Amazing that you say you detest Trump’s behavior, yet in this regard, you copy Trump’s behavior! Your response shows why you need me, SD, AG, Mikef, etc. Without us, your dishonesty would go unchallenged and readers would not have the full truth. They would have the Larry truth.
Now strap on your Depends, take your meds, and take a nap.
Larry, as the saying goes, Rome wasn’t built in a day. America’s disunited states didn’t become that way in day either.
This election could start the country on the road to a calmer place where sanity and might minds are heard while mean spirited competition is all about winning and beating the other side senseless.
You claim you bear no hate for anyone from either perspective. You may stick to your story, but your GOP has not followed your example. Trump, his MAGA crowd, and company have based their campaign on hate mongering and contempt for al who vote blue. Why would people vote to promote hate, revenge, and retribution? In the end whether Trump wins or not, nothing changes, it just gets worse. Trump will continue being mean tempered, self consumed, and transactional in every relationship and impulse driven in decision making. His regime, if elected would divide this country still deeper and push unity further out. In 2028 the election would surely put a Democrat in the White House should Trump have been there after 2024.
Harris came from the shadows that historically has been the VP place and came through for her party in an unprecedented election change up that put her in as candidate just a scant 5 months before Election Day. Trump had been campaigning a solid 8 years and counting until Harris started. Give her the credit due a candidate rising from campaign ashes to where she is on Election Day. You said the race is so very close so no one is confident enough to bet on this race.
Harris had a positive issue driven campaign She refrained from bashing her challenger until in self defense, she gave Trump a mere taste of his own Medicine. Harris took the moral high road while Trump sought the moral gutter and proceeded with his entertainment type reality TV show which was neither good form nor substantive. Trump aimed for his audiences gut emotions. That’s where he realized they kept their politics and choice making processes. As opposed to Harris’ appeal came from a mind-heart connection she demonstrated in her personal approach that is consistent with her speaking her mind. Compared to Trump’s officious letting of gas on stage while in the middle of speaking, Harris’ laugh sound is minimal.
You, Larry must be sitting on pundit and pins in anticipation of Election Results when it appears. The first lines written after these long months before an election and finally you find out whether your target will be front and center for the next four years or if not then your postmortem on the candidate’s foibles campaigning will surely enlighten and entertain. Your reputation for casting dark negativity on another wise open learning opportunity precedes your predictability for believing you are always right. And, as a matter of fact on the right you are.
Read you on the flip side?
AG, good points. As an Independent I feel much the same.
Do not believe Larry if and when he says, “You claim you bear no hate for anyone from either perspective. ” He bears plenty of contempt for people like we Independents who disagree with him and point out the truth. (See his comment to me above if you want to see his contempt).
I do not think the race will be as close as polls seem to indicate because polls do not take into account first time voters who have never voted. I think women and Independents will determine this election. Guys like Larry will be irrelevant. We are the bigger block and most of us hate Trump and what he has done to our country.
Great analysis of where voters keep their voting sense. You are correct about GOP voters. Larry keeps his voting sense in his adult diapers and spills it on pages that he posts.
Great last paragraph. I look forward to Larry’s post election analysis.
I found out today that my parents voted for Kamala Harris. I will never visit their graves again.
Today is the first day after and America is coming to grips with how a scant majority’s choice will impact us all. It’s now the responsibility of the Republicans to ensure Benjamin Franklin’s challenge is kept up. We will see Trump’s presidency understands what a Republic is. Keeping a democratic republic as Franklin believed it should be requires appreciation of democracy’s generous contribution making possible a person like Trump rising a second time to win POTUS.
That more than 50% of the electorate bought Trump’s song and dance routine indicates a big misunderstanding in the minds of the 50%+ more than Trump’s campaigning prowess.
American’s who identify with the politically right wing apparently have broken their moral compasses. That’s assuming those who are Pro-Trump possessed a moral compass before Trump’s influence normalized raw, crude, and inappropriate moral/ethical behavior. What we have here is a double standard, one that make great exceptions for Trump, because Trump is just being Trump. All others of us beside Trump are equal under the law and pay the consequences when the law is broken
You say that Trump’s personal history and general behavior bothers you. The word pugnacious has been mentioned
in relation to Trump’s character. You speak about appreciating his policies. And what exactly are the policies you like which make Trump your choice in the presidency, commander and chief of the military.
This win by Trump is something you have heartily championed and wished for. We shall see if Trump lived up to your expectations in the policy department. Possibly his policies may not work or the plans get countermanded as unpractical.
Considering the things wished for, these could become teal and true. Then it’s wisdom that calls for thoughtful care when making wishes.
Small hint of concession on my part while congratulating your Party at this time. It a Party win not an individual win for you. Every eligible voter has but one vote they may cast. Each vote is valued, of coarse Yet the one vote does not do anything worthy of congratulations. Your team happened to collect the majority count, this time. This grants them whatever the spoils of victory amount to. The individual’s portion of those spoils is a limited share of bragging rights. Nobody appreciates an overly ambitious reveler in victory. Poor loser is Trump’s behavior pattern, which drives denial and decision not to concede. This, too, the right condoned with their not condemning Trump’s Big Lie. After all, that’s a case of Trump being Trump. No questions asked and no comments of correction entered.
The 2020 pity party turned violent and ultimately be the Party of fear and intimidation. Lies are the mother of conspiracy theories. Conspiracy theories are on par with cheating truth from attaining it rightful place in honest society.
Larry, your natural skepticism regarding the Democratic Party and persons you perceive are liberal, as you define liberal, I don’t see you changing at anytime. Negativity and ornery are characteristic of those who cleave to the right. If that’s what worked for you in the win, I trust that the right will not redirect their usual orientation. Their moral compass has ceased working in some cases. Most never developed a moral conscience, like Trump. So, most do not know what a true moral compass is and does.
PBP has become a distasteful bad habit requiring the multi-step program required off a person who realizes the detriment it is in life. Time foregone while following PBP through the past 4 years minimum has cost more than I believe was reasonable. Given my purpose has been educating myself in the thinking that the right used in their reasoning that had them supporting Trump for President.
In my vase following PBP’s authors’ commentaries especially these months running into the election have forced my objective critical thinking capacity beyond critical mass acceptance. Angry disbelief over supposedly intelligent minds on the right would not see through Trump’s smoke screen. Reading commentaries with content the over looked true facts in context caused unhealthy reactions to persons’ posts. I value my time more than the little return on its investment made in PBP. The P in PBP stands for propaganda, not so one would confuse the authors’ work with factual information.
Thanks for the lessons from the other side’s perspectives.
AC You write like an angry and bitter old man who has been proven wrong. And your response is to attack and insult millions of great Americans who do not share your narrow views. As an arrogant left winger, you cannot accept that there are great Americans on both sides. You thrive on divisiveness. I am sure you must feel betrayed by so many Americans of all backgrounds who rejected your elitist political policies.